18 DecEpisode 105 | The Freedom “No-Pull” Harness: On the origins of School For The Dogs’ #1 selling harness, with 2 Hounds Design’s president Alisha Navarro
At School For The Dogs, we are very picky about products we recommend: We try to guide our clients towards products that we feel really work well and are made by US-based, sustainability-minded small businesses. North Carolina-based business 2 Hounds Designs ticks all the boxes. In particular, we are big fans of their Freedom Harness. It is one of only two harnesses that we sell in our Manhattan shop and in our online store. This innovative "no-pull" front-clip harness is one of the best selling items in our shop, and for good reason: it helps dogs learn to stop pulling! Annie interviews 2 Hounds' president, Alisha Navarro, who stumbled upon a little-known harness design nearly 18 years ago, purchased the patent, and now has a factory and 40+ employees who are working to keep up with ever-increasing demand for it. Annie and Alisha discuss why the harness works so well, the design's origins, its diehard fans, how the manufacturing side of the business was impacted by the coronavirus, and more.
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Transcript:
[Intro and music]
Alisha Navarro:
I'm Alisha Navarro. And I'm the founder and president of 2 Hounds Design.
Annie:
And how would you describe what 2 Hounds Design is?
Alisha:
So we make dog colors, harnesses, and leashes. Our harness is a patented no-pull harness. It has a Swiss velvet lining, and it's all made in the USA. And our collars are pretty high end. We're known for creating collars with our own ribbon designs.
We also use some really high-end materials. Sometimes we'll use home decoration materials, something that you would see in a luxury home. We'll use that to put on collars. We've also taken wedding dresses apart and make collars out of them to match the bridal party. So we've done some really fun stuff on our collar side as well.
Annie:
So I discovered 2 Hounds because of the Freedom Harness. And so I'm really curious about that, but first I wanted to ask you, why is it called 2 Hounds?
Alisha:
2 Hounds Design was named after my original two retired racing greyhounds, Iceman and Paradise. I adopted Paradise first in 2001, and I adopted Iceman in 2002, I believe. And then in 2003, I founded my company, and we were trying to come up with a name for it. And the company exists because of them, because I was selling collars for them. So we just named the company after them.
Annie:
So the Freedom No-Pull Harness is one of our best-selling items both in our online store and in our actual shop. And it is one of only two harnesses that we sell. And it's definitely the harness that we recommend most. I love it for some reasons you already mentioned, for instance, I love that it has the velvet under the armpits. I love the front attachment.
I was first made aware of this style of harness because of the Easy Walk harness, which is a similar harness, that I think is not as good actually. But I'd love to hear the story of how you came to discover this kind of harness. I understand that you didn't invent it. But you kind of well, tell me, I bet there's a good story here.
Alisha:
So the Freedom Harness, the thing that I love the most about it is actually that martingale loop on the back of the harness. And because I had retired racing greyhounds, and when I first founded the company, we were very focused on greyhound specific, because I belong to a big community. You know, I was really trying to serve that community. So we really focused on martingale.
So I loved the fact that the harness had a martingale on the back of it, which does help prevent escape, as long as the harness is adjusted correctly. So that was what drew me to it initially for the greyhounds. Because, I don't know if you're familiar with them in New York City, but greyhounds have a very high, or can tend to have a very high prey drive. And because they’re sight hounds, they can't find their way back, always if they can't actually see.
So keeping them on leash is really important. Making sure they don't escape from equipment is really important. So that's actually why I first loved the Freedom Harness. I started buying it from the original inventor and I was selling it on our own website. This was when we were still quite small. We were still working out of my home.
And one night I had faxed in an order some crazy hour, and somehow she and I ended up on a conversation and long story short, I ended up licensing the patent for the harness and becoming the exclusive manufacturer of it. And then I later purchased the patent from her. So it's practically my child. I just love this harness.
Annie:
How did you first discover this inventor's harness?
Alisha:
Because she was also part of the Greyhound community. And so a lot of Greyhound people were already using it, so I discovered it through that. And then, because I already had a website, it was something additional that I could offer on my website to my posters.
Annie:
And at that point, were you selling mostly collars?
Alisha:
Yes. Our business was 95% collars at that time and that's completely flipped now. We're about 75% harness and 25% collars now.
Annie:
And how did she come up with the Freedom Harness design?
Alisha:
know the part of the story that I know. I could probably send you like a link to her story and how she created it. She was working with a very large Rottweiler who was pulling really, really hard. And so my understanding is, is that she decided there wasn't anything on the market that was really helping her. And so she decided to try her hand at coming up with something herself and she did a really good job.
Annie:
Can you describe exactly how it works? Kind of what it looks like to someone who might be listening and has no idea what the Freedom Harness is, or why it's special?
Alica:
Absolutely. So the Swiss velvet lining that we've both already mentioned is probably everybody's favorite feature. That's the strap that goes right behind the front legs. And that Swiss velvet lining provides just a little bit of padding, a little bit of softness, and it helps prevent rubbing and chafing behind the front legs.
But the actual really cool part about the harness is how it functions to help train your dog. So we have the front and the back connection on the harness. We were one of the first harnesses on the market with a front and back connection at the same time. And I know that T Touch practitioners really love the two points of contact when they're working with dogs.
It also, we find if you're using a front only connection, a lot of times, you can see if you get a dog who gets really excited and decides to lunge forward really hard or decides to try to make a run for it. We've actually seen dogs do a somersault if they're connected only to a front connection harness. So that second connection gives you a better, just better control if your dog does decide to lunge, they're not going to have a funny center of balance, or center of gravity, and flip right over.
So that part right there is probably the least known. It just seems like a lot of trainers love to use that front connection. And I personally just love using both the front and the back for that reason.
It also helps keep the spine in alignment when you're using both connections. So when you're using that front only, and your dog is pulling ahead and they'll kind of pull off to the side and their shoulders will twist just a little bit. When you have that second connection with them, it keeps their spine in alignment as well.
So the science behind it and, and the mechanics behind it are my personal favorite part.
Annie:
Yeah. And you guys also sell leashes that can clip at both the front or the back. And I usually tell clients, you can attach it to the back if you're out for a hike or it really doesn't matter if your dog is like way out in front of you. Or you can just use the front or you could use both.
Alisha:
Right. And that's one of the ways that the Freedom Harness is really versatile because dogs need enrichment. They don't just need a nice trained walk where they stay by your side. They also need to sniff and smell and see and explore. And so when you're fine with your dog doing that, you can use just that back connection and your dog can have the room to explore and everything.
But then when it's time, maybe you're getting ready to walk in traffic, or maybe you need your dog to be right beside you. You have that option without changing out the harness to make it turn it back into a working harness, which I think is a great feature as well.
Annie:
I also explain to people, and I don't know if this is why T Touch people like it as well. But what I like about having a leash connected to both the front and the back is you're giving a little bit more information as far as pressure. You can train a dog almost like you're riding a horse. If I put a little pressure this way, that means we're going left or this way it means we're going right. If they have those two points of contact, they can feel that I think with a little bit more clarity.
Alisha:
Yes. And, the leash that we offer with the harness has a floating handle. So the really nice thing is if you're not necessarily skilled enough to do a two handed leash — you know, a lot of trainers will do the two handed leash and they'll give micro-communication to a dog. And sometimes like neither the dog nor the person realize that they're communicating with each other. But they'll give micro communications just like you said, with a little bit of pressure here, or a little bit of pressure on the other side, and that communicates to the dog which way we're going.
But the floating handle on the leash actually does that work for you. So if you're not necessarily skilled enough to use two hands to handle the leash, the leash will actually do a lot of that work for you.
Annie:
How do you explain to people how the front clip helps to reduce pulling?
Alisha:
So the opposition reflex, I'm sure you've probably talked about that a good bit with your clients as well. The opposition reflex is the instinct for a dog to pull against pressure on the chest. That front clip works against the opposition reflex because it redirects more towards the side. And so the pressure isn't really uniform across the chest. Did I explained that well?
Annie:
Well, how would you explain what opposition reflex is, I guess, cause that sounds fancy.
Alica:
Well, opposition reflex, which is also called the freedom reflex by some trainers. Like when you have a sled dog and you put a special harness on a sled dog that really distributes that pressure evenly all the way across that front chest. When they feel that pressure, their instinct is to pull against it. And that's the opposition reflex.
Annie:
Right. Or I explain it to someone like, if I pull your hand, your instinct is going to be to pull back.
Alisha:
Yes, exactly.
Annie:
And so if the dog is pulling forward and the pressure on the chest is pushing back at them, then their instinct is to push against —
Alisha:
To push harder. Right.
Annie:
Which would be pushing then forward.
Alisha:
Right.
Annie:
Right? No I'm all confused now [laughs]
Alisha:
Well, the end result, because you're at the end of the leash. What they're doing is pushing against the pressure they feel on their chest. What you're feeling is that they're pulling ahead of you because the result of them pushing against that pressure on their chest is that they're pulling on the leash.
I'm a physics major. I can explain the mechanics of it. [laughing]
Annie?
Have you changed the pattern at all from the original, and also when did you start? You mentioned faxing back and forth with those persons.
Alisha:
Oh. I know, this was a long time ago.
Annie:
It was 1980.
Alisha:
No, are you kidding me? I'm 20 years old. [laughing]
We founded the company in 2003. And I was actually just joking with someone earlier that I founded the company when I was 26 and at 26, I didn't feel responsible enough to have kids, but somehow I started a company.
But I founded the in 2003, and then in 2009, we licensed the patent and began making the Freedom Harness.
Annie:
Your based in North Carolina. Is that right?
Alisha:
We are, and everything's made in North Carolina. I'm sitting here in my office right now. And I have windows that look out on the production floor. So I really love, I just love being able to know that we're giving people jobs and we're keeping manufacturing here. We use US sourced materials everywhere that we can. So there's a lot of really social things that are important to me as well.
Annie:
How many employees do you have now?
Alisha:
I believe we're currently at 48 and still hiring.
Annie:
Oh my gosh.
Alisha:
Yeah, the pandemic has wrecked our supply chain. It's wrecked a lot of things, but we've had just insane growth even this year through everything that's been going on. And I'm super grateful for absolutely everything.
Annie:
What do you think that's due to?
Alica:
Well, we do a big trainer outreach because we love working with trainers and we know that trainers are influencers in the dog world. You know, if a trainer tells you to buy something, you're going to buy it. If you go to your trainer with a problem, and the trainer tells you, Here, let me help you fix this, you're going to buy it. And so, because trainers really love this product, we tend to focus a lot of our outreach there.
We work with a lot of veterinarians, a lot of behaviorists, and we find that that really influences the purchasing behavior of the consumer. So that tends to drive our sales through stores. We have trainers who either have their own store, like you do. We have freelancer trainers who go to people's homes and train dogs, and sometimes they'll have a trunk full of Freedom Harnesses. Or sometimes what they'll do is recommend other stores in the area that carry the products that they want the person to buy.
So that's been probably a huge part of our growth. And we sponsor a number of trainer organizations. We work with APDT and Animal Behavior College, and Force Free Wisconsin, I believe it is. And then there's the pet professionals guild. So, we try to really work with the organizations and have conversations because I think that the conversations are really important. And we want to get the harnesses in the hands of the trainers, let them try them.
Annie:
How does it compare to — well, I guess two questions. One, the Easy Walk is, like I said, the product that I was first familiar with as a front clip harness. I'm wondering if that's still sort of the major product that is comparable. And I'm also wondering how it compares, too. The Easy Walk.
Alica:
Yeah. And I mean, the Easy Walk is a great product. It's been around for close to about the same amount of time as the Freedom Harness. The biggest difference between the two is that we have the two points of contact: that connection on the front and the connection on the back. And we have the Swiss velvet lining, which helps protect their delicate skin back there behind the armpits.
We also have a sternum strap in the front. So one of the things that, well, we call it a sternum strap. That's a technical term. It's that strap that goes between the two front legs. So that strap right there actually gives a lot of stability to the harness. And it keeps it from sagging as much as you see with some of the front only connection harnesses. Sometimes you'll see those either lose their adjustment or, or they're just not adjusted correctly. And you'll see them even sagging down below the, where the legs start sometimes.
So the Freedom Harness does tend to sit higher on the chest, so it doesn't impede movement. It keeps those legs free to move forward. And I mean, there's a number of differences between the products.
What I typically tell people is figure out what works best for your dog, because every dog is built differently and every dog thinks differently. I know, you know, dogs think. So, you know, what works for one might not work for all.
Annie:
And are there other products out there that, that you, I mean, is that a product that you compete with or are there other products out there that are, that are similar? That you think are good or not good?
Alisha:
I typically try really hard not to express an opinion good or not good about other products. I tend to compete a lot with myself more than with other products. I find that my life has happier that way, if that makes sense.
Annie:
Fair enough.
Alisha:
Yeah. I mean, there's a, there are a ton of harnesses. There's a lot more out there now than when we got started. When we got started, it was basically Sense-ation, Easy Walk and us. And you know, Easy Walk, they're a huge corporation and they had the marketing dollars and that was the one that was in PetSmart and Petco. And that's the one that all the trainers knew.
So we haven't gone necessarily with the Pet Smart and Petco route, partially because we're made in the USA and we don't have the margins to sell the big box stores. Partially because we really like to support the independent retailers. Like I said, there's a social aspect to our company as well. And we really like to support the people who support us and the people who have helped us grow all along the way.
So that does I guess decrease the amount of exposure that we get, because you do have dog owners who are just going to go to PetSmart. They're not necessarily going to go to the neighborhood store. And you might have towns that don't have a small neighborhood store, or whatever the small neighborhood store is in their town might not carry our products. So it does limit our exposure to go that route, but it's important to us tos support the right people.
Annie:
Well, what I like about I mean, there are a lot of things I like about the Freedom Harness versus the two that you mentioned, the Sense-ation and the Easy Walk. Which, I think we did carry the Sense-ation for a little while. But yeah, we've never carried the Easy Walk just because, because it is sold so many places, and we try and sell things that are like a little different.
But I think that's sternum strap makes such a huge difference, because there's so many times that I see dogs wearing Easy Walks and they're basically being walked by, like, the corner of their shoulder.
Alisha:
Right. And the front connection is always going to be difficult, because when you have a dog who's pulling against that front connection, the harness is going to adjust forward. So trying to get the adjustments and the fit correct is really hard. And that sternum strap gives it that bit of stability that I believe helps you get a better fit.
Annie:
Yeah. I also like that there's really only one way to put it on. It's very hard to put on backwards. I mean, almost every day, I think I see someone with a dog who has the Easy Walk on backwards and it's like, it's like a bad, like a grammatical mistake or something. Like I have to like bite my tongue to not go over to the person and be like, you know, your harness is on upside down!
Alisha:
That's funny.
Annie:
Nobody wants the weird woman on the street telling them how they're dog harness is.
Alisha:
So, my deal is I go around adjusting people's harnesses and their collars. Like I’m the world's worst — like, Hey, your harness is too loose. Do you mind if I adjust it for you?
[laughing]
Annie:
So you mentioned, you mentioned COVID affecting your business. I'm curious, you've talked about the supply chain. Can you talk a little bit more about that?
Alisha:
Sure. It's been a challenge. This has been probably the most difficult year we have ever faced. We've definitely had supply chain issues. We've had shipments sit on the water because there were no workers to accept at the ports, to be able to accept the big boats to get our hardware off of the big boat. And so our hardware has been delayed.
And then we've had the Swiss mill that makes our Swiss velvet that goes on the straps, on that strap that everybody loves. Their mill has been hit by COVID as well. They're working, they're doing the same thing that we are. They've had to do the social distancing. They've got all their employees at least six feet apart. They're working with a smaller staff, because trying to limit exposure. And the result of that is they can't make as much velvet, which means we can't always get our shipments complete.
So we've had, like right now this minute, if somebody desperately needed a navy blue harness, they couldn't get it from us because I don't even have the velvet to make it. We're sitting here waiting for a shipment. So this is the first year that we've ever had any type of issues on this level. We've had other supply chain issues in the past. That's just part of doing business, but on this level, this is the first year we've dealt with anything like this.
And then, on any given day currently, I've got probably 10% of my staff out, either waiting for results, or either they've tested positive or a family member has tested positive and they're quarantining. And so out of 48 employees, if I've got 10% of my staff out, that's a lot. I mean, that's a significant number. It reduces our ability to run production effectively, or efficiently.
The majority of the issues that we've had have all been just things that were just outside of our control. We're learning how to be a lot more accepting of circumstances outside of our control, I guess.
Annie:
Right. Well, and I know you also go to trade shows.
Alisha:
Yeah. Our last trade show was Global Pet Expo last March. And that was right when everybody was announcing — or when people were starting to talk about COVID, and I think attendance was maybe down a bit at that show. Everything else has been either canceled or virtual. Not being able to talk to people, not being able to get in front of people is really hard.
Annie:
Right. Right. So what's the future of 2 Hounds, more products? Or just gonna keep doing what you're doing?
Alisha:
We have some really cool projects actually coming. We launched our earth style collection at Global.
Annie:
Oh yes! I love it.
Alisha:
Yes. So what's funny. And that we ran into our first supply chain issues right after we launched that, that was caused by COVID. So we launched it at global pet expo and it, I mean, it took off. We sold through our first round of the raw material that we had purchased right away.
Annie:
And what is the raw material?
Alisha:
Oh yeah. I got to tell you that part, the webbing itself is made from recycled plastic bottles. I think that's the coolest thing ever. So they take the plastic bottles and they grind them down into these little pellets, and then they extrude them and they create long continuous fibers and they weave those fibers into the webbing itself. I think it's the best thing since sliced bread. I'm so excited.
Annie:
And the patterns are super cute. They make me think of like Lisa Frank.
Alisha:
Oh, we've got some more coming actually. Oh, I love, I loved Lisa Frank. I can’t believe you referenced her. I grew up with the Lisa Frank folders and notebooks.
Annie:
Yeah, we're children of the eighties.
Alisha:
We are, clearly, obviously. But yeah, we've got more patterns coming. We'll be launching those in first quarter of 2020. And I actually have my own sublimation set up being delivered. We had been outsourcing the sublimation printing on the webbing. And just a note about that. It's actually, the print is molecularly bonded to the webbing itself, so it doesn't ever wear off, or like it doesn't scratch off or anything.
So we are bringing that printing in house so that we can do a lot more designs on kind of a shorter run basis, so we could do a lot more fashion type stuff. So I'm really excited about that.
Annie:
Wow. So you could do like a School for the Dogs custom sublimated recycled harness?
Alisha:
We actually, yes, we absolutely can. That's going to be part of what we'll be rolling out to the trainers in the stores. We could do short runs so we don't have the high minimums anymore because we can do it here in house. So if you need, if you wanted to order a short run of harnesses and leashes with your logo or with your colors, or if you've got an event coming up, we can do that for you.
Annie:
Oh my God. Definitely. That's really, really cool.
Alisha:
Yeah. This is probably the project I've been most excited about and in a number of years. It's also really stressful and it's delayed. Again, because of the pandemic, everything is delayed. So our machine, there's two big machines that you have to use to do this. And we're hoping it'll be here by the last week of December.
Annie:
Well, thanks so much. Anything else you want to mention?
Alisha:
No, I'd love to thank you for what you're doing, though. You know, I've actually been to your store. We filmed a video in your store.
Annie:
That's right.
Alisha:
And it's one of the best laid out and best training facilities. I was really impressed with it.
Annie:
Oh, thank you.
Alisha:
So I really appreciate you reaching out, and I appreciate all of your help over the years and your support and everything. You've been great.
Annie:
Well, you guys have been great too, and I love what you're doing. And yeah, and I love going — like, I'm such a nerd about these things. Like I love trade shows. [laughs]
Alisha:
They're actually really fun. I'm an introvert, but somehow I still managed to enjoy trade shows. It's just afterwards I hide in a dark room for a bit to recover. [laughs]
Annie:
Oh my God. Well, right. And it must be different. I'm usually just the person wandering around, it must be different if you're [inaudible] talking non-stop.
Alisha:
I do love it though. I miss talking to people. I miss hearing what's going on.
Annie:
Yeah. I'm sorry we won't get to see each other at the trade shows, because also as someone who's, you know, buying for a store, it's nice to be able to talk to the people that I'm emailing with all the time.
Alisha:
Right. Yeah.
Annie:
So, I hope we get to do that again soon. I dunno. I've been to Global once. That's the one in Florida, must be canceled for 2020. I'm guessing.
Alisha:
Not officially, and we do have a booth reserved. I don't know yet if it's going to happen, you know, I don't know what the status of the vaccine's going to be. I don't know if people are going to be ready to travel yet. I think SuperZoo in Las Vegas, that’s in August, I believe. I think by August, we're probably going to be in a bit better shape. So I'm hopeful for Super Zoo.
Annie:
Me too. That one that one's out West.
Alisha:
That one's in Vegas. Yes. And it’s a lot of fun.
Annie:
Well, thank you so much, Alisha. For those of you listening, you can get the Freedom Harness, which comes in tons of cool colors, at storeforthedogs.com. There's the earth style collection that Alisha was just talking about, but there's also in addition to, you know, basic black, blue, and red, like a beautiful burgundy, teal, turquoise, tan, and brown. We also carry matching leashes, both in Swiss velvet and nylon. And we carry lots of their really gorgeous collars.
For a limited time, you can get 10% off any two hounds product at storeforthedogs.com using code Alisha.
